>>23954>i would give you the israeli jewish perspective, that unfortunately many jews in the US forgot .Or never had. Despite many ties between us (I have Israeli friends, clients, and family members) we're two separate countries with two separate histories. A lot of overlap for sure, but still different. Which means there's not one jewish perspective, despite what gatekeeping sabras like to think.
>"zionism",or the idea that jews hould return for the land and recreate a jewish sovereignty ,was always a thing among jews ever since the times of ezra and nehemia .This is true, I didn't mean to make it seem otherwise though I see how I did. More that American Jews are rethinking it recently, given the attitudes and actions of recent right wing Israeli govts, and the schism between right and left in the US in general, which is particularly stark among Jews. The embrace by many right wing Jews here of a fascist nationalist like Trump — whom they're now backing away from, only when he buddies up to people who literally support Naziism — was a line in the sand.
>the fact that the plurality of jews at the 40's-60's were orthodox ,Not in the US.
> and harassment against jews at the time etc contributed a lot for it.Anti-semitism in the US, which was rampant and institutional, was a huge factor til WWII, which led to a huge shift in attitudes here. The US govt was neutral as far as the establishment of Israel but American Jews supported it near-univerally.
> the later shift in the american jewery make up,it isolation from the old world jewery,the increased assimilation with non jews and more are the reasons why the american jewery started looking down on the jewish state ,rather than thinking that israel became increasingly rightwing (which on it own is more of a bouncing back to the natural state of the world jewery prior to ww2 ).This is just not true. American Jews were overwhelmingly left wing in the first half and middle of the 20th century and a majority still are. Even beyond the start of the Cold War, when Americans moved away from Socialism. The Left in this country was almost synonymous with Judaism til fairly recently. Israeli policy towards Palestinians has been the main factor as to why things are changing, forcing left-leaning or liberal Jews to make a difficult decision. FYI, Support for Israel was universal among Jews as late as my teens (1980s).
As for the rightward shift, it's not perception. I hate to tell you your history but Hertzl was a secular socialist and your country was capital-S socialist for most of its history.
> i think that the main reason that now days most american jews are drifting even further than israel is due to mass assimaltion.You're right, as this is the story of America, from Germans to Italians to Mexicans to Vietnamese. We all assimilate and then influence each other. The US has a unique type of multiculturalism that's difficult to explain to Europeans and other ostensibly similar societies. Freedom to practice one's religion and culture also means freedom to abandon or blend aspects of it.
>>23955> most of the bible is made of historical events.No, it's based very loosely on historical events. E.G., the end of the ice age and sudden rise in sea levels was genesis of flood myths that exist in mythology around the world.
>the minimalist faction in regard to archaeology and bible interpretation is getting weaker by the day.Okay, you've kinda outed yourself because that's bullshit, at least among actual archeologists — scientists — and not fundamentalists inventing "evidence" to justify a historical scripture either grabbing up land or delegitimizing other groups of people.
> the handful of histocial sites that prove that the many section of the bible ,some stone stele that prove events that are written in the bible and the better understanding of the late bronze age are examples of those...Bottom line, I've not seen ~academic~ evidence there were Jewish slaves in Egypt.
> not even the most extremist of israeli right-winger calls for a genocide.College friend of mine, just out of the IDF, said exactly that. You need to pay attention to your current cabinet, because...
> at most they call for a forced population transfer "Forced population transfer" is a form of genocide. Talk to the Armenians.
> (as a response to the one done for mizrahi and sefaradi jews in the 50's)We can do that all night and all day. That's why South Africa had a truth and reconciliation commission, because "whatabout..." gets us nowhere. That is, if the goal is peace and coexistence.
> most israeli mainstreams ideas for solving the conflict are ... encouraging migration by economic means.Good luck with that, and better hope our countries stay friends for the next 80 years of war there.
> p.s. -the hassidis are either indifferent or supporting israel now days tbh. the satamr folk are pretty much an outliersI think you have it mixed up...? Lubavich are ardent zionists, Satmars ardent the other way. There are far more Lubavich than Satmars both in NYC and everywhere else on earth.
LOL we Jews do love to argue, a tradition from long before the internet existed.